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#1534905 by hOG (Crusader Mod) at 2013-06-30 13:14:50 (3 weeks ago) - [Report]
The Americans are snowed in this time around. It used to be that good ol fashioned intelligence service was done on the premise 'national security interests'. The end of the cold war and global economy means intelligence services broadened that scope to include political and economical interests. Companies spy on each other as do governments. It was just never in the open, as it has become now, and the biggest complainer is also the biggest spy. For months prior to the Snowden-leak the US launched campaigns internationally against China accusing them of hacking in the US. The biggest player however remains the US. The US and Obama is monitoring the world (and you still believe in "change"):
EU concern over Der Spiegel claim of US spying "According to the document - which Der Spiegel says comes from the NSA - the agency spied on EU internal computer networks in Washington and at the 27-member bloc's UN office in New York. The document also allegedly referring to the EU as a "target"."
- Source
U.S. taps half-billion German phone, internet links in month: report "The document Spiegel cited showed that the United States categorized Germany as a "third-class" partner and that surveillance there was stronger than in any other EU country, similar in extent to China, Iraq or Saudi-Arabia. "We can attack the signals of most foreign third-class partners, and we do it too," Der Spiegel quoted a passage in the NSA document as saying. It said the document showed that the NSA monitored phone calls, text messages, emails and internet chat contributions and has saved the metadata - that is, the connections, not the content - at its headquarters. On an average day, the NSA monitored about 20 million German phone connections and 10 million internet data sets, rising to 60 million phone connections on busy days, the report said."
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US army blocks access to Guardian website to preserve 'network hygiene' "The US army has admitted to blocking access to parts of the Guardian website for thousands of defence personnel across the country. A spokesman said the military was filtering out reports and content relating to government surveillance programs to preserve "network hygiene" and prevent any classified material appearing on unclassified parts of its computer systems."
- Source
Nobody seems to care, least of all the media. Their silence is deafening, since it's the guy they got elected who's in charge. Eight years ago there would have been (righteouss) outrage, but not anymore. When half the population is on the government dole, in one form or another, all that matters is the people more likely to keep the goodies coming stay in office. We've traded liberty for (false) security, disregarding the warnings of our forefathers. I find it highly unlikely that the trend is reversible.
this should be a major deal as I posted earlier that if our gov is spying on us rest assured they are doing even worst to you guys, but Paula Dean dared to admit that she said the word 'nigger' 30 years ago so that of course is the top story in this country. If they do let it slip out about this spying thing they make sure everybody knows Snowden is a high school drop out because that is the real story according to our government media.
People are either not surprised, or they do not care. It is just so predictable. A character assassination of Snowden, quickly shifting to the next the media cycle so that people forget, using the good old terrorism and safety excuse... and far above all that, beyond anyone's reach, the arrogance, lack of accountability and absolute disdain of the unreachable, unshakable and ultimately uncaring powers that be.
It's not that the governments have grown big, but that they have grown too far too high above the people. There is literally no way for this to stop. So what if thousands (millions?) are outraged, or that the EU complains. They will keep at it - and worse. Because they can and there is nothing that could stop them.
So what if thousands (millions?) are outraged, or that the EU complains. They will keep at it - and worse. Because they can and there is nothing that could stop them.
well i think the EU is just using the tried and tested British approach where they try to get it both ways by acting above it all while at the same time going along for the ride from the word go...
Every government spys on everyone and always will.
our "friends" Israel spy on us and sell our military secrets to the Chinese yet we continue to publicly masturbate them and hand them our tax payers money.
Every government spys on everyone and always will.
our "friends" Israel spy on us and sell our military secrets to the Chinese yet we continue to publicly masturbate them and hand them our tax payers money.
Didn't know that Italy had military secrets or gave public funds to Israel. Cheers for that bit of info. Unless of course by 'our' you mean American. Remind us, how much of your money in Italy is sent to the USA, in the form of tax dollars DIRECTLY from your account(s), and then from there on over to Israel. $2? $3? $0?
Just because governments spy on people, sell secrets and waste tax dollars doesn't mean they should do it. Apathetic society allows governments to do these things so they will. Really the blame lies with voters supporting the system that is flawed and getting worse. I digress.
Every government spys on everyone and always will.
our "friends" Israel spy on us and sell our military secrets to the Chinese yet we continue to publicly masturbate them and hand them our tax payers money.
Didn't know that Italy had military secrets or gave public funds to Israel. Cheers for that bit of info. Unless of course by 'our' you mean American. Remind us, how much of your money in Italy is sent to the USA, in the form of tax dollars DIRECTLY from your account(s), and then from there on over to Israel. $2? $3? $0?
Just because governments spy on people, sell secrets and waste tax dollars doesn't mean they should do it. Apathetic society allows governments to do these things so they will. Really the blame lies with voters supporting the system that is flawed and getting worse. I digress.
You do realise I am American right? You also realize I still pay taxes in the US as I own property? But thanks for trying.
#1534992 by hOG (Crusader Mod) at 2013-07-01 11:54:02 (3 weeks ago) - [Report]
Belnick wrote:
yea, it is only criminals and terrorists that are pissed off
noone else care about this, i think it is good they get Intel like that
That is not true. If you had read the links I linked to in the OP you would realize that isn't the truth. National security and spying and wiretapping and so on pisses off the criminals and terrorists. That is what has been going on always, and always will like Timex says.
But the tapping of EU offices for example with the intention of making it easier for the Obama administration for the upcoming free trade agreement in 2014 between EU and US (friends right..), is a major diplomatic disaster. And if you live in Europe - regardless whether you are an American who has moved here or not - it could VERY WELL hurt you financially, as the EU would sit at the negotiation table and not be able to get any upper hand. That will cost jobs in the EU, investments, etc.
yea, it is only criminals and terrorists that are pissed off
You are damn right they are pissed off.Just think what it could happen if US don`t spy on us.Any semi-retarded teenager from Chechnya could bomb the Boston marathon by using a cooking pot.Imagine that!But thanks God they are spying on all of us and such a horrible thing will never happen.
Every government spys on everyone and always will.
I don't know why you guys insist on using word spy since even before all this "spying" scandals most of citizens of USA were monitored since 1862 when income tax was created and IRS came to everyday live. And in every country that has such thing like taxes you are monitored and directed by using money.
After 9/11 US citizens were stupid enough to let goverment pass such ridiculus bill like The Patriot Act which should stop working in 2005, but it still goes on. So whatever "spying" occurs like in this Snowden Scandal it's all dandy, cuz it's legal.
And about US agencies monitoring what other countries do? Wow. I mean none of you watched The Godfather? "Keep your friends close, but enemies closer" rings a bell? And today it seems like every one is an enemy of US goverment and all those agencies have shitloads of work.
mbodnar wrote:
Nobody seems to care, least of all the media. Their silence is deafening, since it's the guy they got elected who's in charge.
Well i wouldn't go that far, cuz I really don't believe that US, as a empire as it is with all this influence, Saudi cash, resources in us border and acces to them abroad, mililitary and so on, is really ruled by a guy who was elected for 4 years (8 if ppl are really fuckin retarded). I mean he will take the beating, but don't worry it won't stop with him. I think that there is a higher chance that media was paid to not make big fuss about it or what is even more possible media don't care about anything else except for ratings and they just found new fun topic to boost them.
When will the Us riot? theres are so many problems with this country I cant even begin. Are people getting organized?
If I lived there I would, you have big banks screwing you over, the government spying on you, basic rights being ignored by the police everywhere.
When will the Us riot? theres are so many problems with this country I cant even begin. Are people getting organized?
If I lived there I would, you have big banks screwing you over, the government spying on you, basic rights being ignored by the police everywhere.
Its crazy...
you just described the situation in 90% of countries around the world.
When will the Us riot? theres are so many problems with this country I cant even begin. Are people getting organized?
If I lived there I would, you have big banks screwing you over, the government spying on you, basic rights being ignored by the police everywhere.
Its crazy...
you just described the situation in 90% of countries around the world.
seems most countries actually are rioting
Its just that in America corruption and foul play has been exposed on repeated occasions, seems as the country must be at a boiling point soon
seems as though a lot of people don't have a clue. full on rioting in the streets, in the US, for what? nothing in the US is bad enough to do that. no group of people has been negatively affected enough to even float the idea.
comparing US problems with eastern europe, middle east or brazil is near laughable. no fucking way US riots over our petty shit, it's not perfect by any means but puuhhhlease.... by national standards US is still easily among the best, by my personal standards US floats high in a bowl of shit but i digress.
Last edited by slacker4life at 2013-07-01 21:05:41
full on rioting in the streets, in the US, for what? nothing in the US is bad enough to do that. no group of people has been negatively affected enough to even float the idea.
.
don't speak too soon that Zimmerman show trial is going to for sure lead to a riot, the media has made sure of that with their one sided reporting of it.
seems as though a lot of people don't have a clue. full on rioting in the streets, in the US, for what? nothing in the US is bad enough to do that. no group of people has been negatively affected enough to even float the idea.
comparing US problems with eastern europe, middle east or brazil is near laughable. no fucking way US riots over our petty shit, it's not perfect by any means but puuhhhlease.... by national standards US is still easily among the best, by my personal standards US floats high in a bowl of shit but i digress.
I do agree on "no riots" part, but from far diffrent reasons. First reason is "terrorism" and perpetual fear laying behind it, which couses ppl to blindly throw away everything to protect from it. Second reason is that we are all equal, but there are ppl more equal than others. Ppl with money and influence (both so hollywood stars doesn't count) don't go to jail in US. Never. Most transparent example are all those executives, directors and all sorts of higher-ups which took any part in economical crisis. No punishment whatsoever and they were even bailed out by goverment from taxpayers money. There is more reasons, but look them up yourself.
And judging from the fact that around 70% of US wealth is in hands of 1% population, i guess 99% is quite huge amount of ppl that was screwed over enough to start riots. I won't even start on things like medical care, ppl that balance on poverty line like acrobatics, shootings, international conflicts and so on...
Remeber North Korea atomic threats and how it vanished? I would start looking what bills were passed during that time
Sure rest of the world have their problems, but 1 problem of America can become huge problem for family in Taiwan, tho not for long since if factory would get closed there they would just starve to death pretty quickly. It's called influence.
Back to "spying". Again, it's nothing new and i wouldn't care about it so much. Soon there will be some new exciting stories to fire up "people" attention. "People" have really short memory.
#1535031 by Timex (Power User) at 2013-07-02 01:32:29 (3 weeks ago) - [Report]
qbert95 wrote:
...Zimmerman...
The GF watches Court TV and gets so upset...seems like I am the only one in the house that pays attention to a thing called "facts".
First Casey,then Jodi and now George.
#1535058 by hOG (Crusader Mod) at 2013-07-02 12:51:56 (3 weeks ago) - [Report]
Putin playing with Obama
Snowden awaits asylum decisions, drops Russia bid "WikiLeaks, which has been helping Snowden, said the 30-year-old had sent asylum requests to 21 countries.
Russia, Norway, Austria and Poland were among the first to confirm they had received the applications. Warsaw immediately rejected the request.
Snowden's latest major leak about US spying on EU countries has angered many European governments and threatens to derail preparations for talks on a huge free trade deal between Washington and Brussels.
Russian President Vladimir Putin on Monday said Snowden was welcome to stay as long as he stopped leaking US intelligence reports."
- Source
yea, it is only criminals and terrorists that are pissed off
You are damn right they are pissed off.Just think what it could happen if US don`t spy on us.Any semi-retarded teenager from Chechnya could bomb the Boston marathon by using a cooking pot.Imagine that!But thanks God they are spying on all of us and such a horrible thing will never happen.
they had one slip, they already knew about them before
are you not gonna list how many they stopped?
ahh no that would go against your thinking, only negative things counts
you would not kill 1 child to save millions of children, i see.
#1535085 by unknown[81460] at 2013-07-02 18:22:00 (3 weeks ago) - [Report]
This is no surprise. I bet every country is doing the same.
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(Mad Ultra Mod) at 2013-07-01 00:21:10 (3 weeks ago) - [
