A very different wild approach could be to let them buy things from the west as is what they asks for. I mean what is the worst that can happen? That the people get food? They said we have nukes, if you do not let us buy things from the west we will start a war. UN answers with more sanctions. UN more or less declared war on horrible state that has nukes.
What is sanctioned these days ?
Weapons and related stuff + some luxyry everyday items.
All the more serious sanctions are vetoed by china and russia.
The issue is their will, they rather spend on military and shit rather than on their people.
There has to be a limit and in the case of NK, the limit has been reached.
#1523877 by mrunne (Power User) at 2013-03-08 14:34:16 (4 months ago) - [Report]
sniperfin wrote:
beblebox wrote:
A very different wild approach could be to let them buy things from the west as is what they asks for. I mean what is the worst that can happen? That the people get food? They said we have nukes, if you do not let us buy things from the west we will start a war. UN answers with more sanctions. UN more or less declared war on horrible state that has nukes.
What is sanctioned these days ?
Weapons and related stuff + some luxyry everyday items.
All the more serious sanctions are vetoed by china and russia.
The issue is their will, they rather spend on military and shit rather than on their people.
There has to be a limit and in the case of NK, the limit has been reached.
But the response to the limit is what? I doubt the US + Allies canīt just invade NK like they did with Kuwait/Iraq back in the day. The nuclear threat is still there.
What is funny (or rather sad) about NK leadership is that they rather let their people starve to death than allow outside aid.
#1523913 by mossi (Power User) at 2013-03-08 16:45:35 (4 months ago) - [Report]
mrunne wrote:
sniperfin wrote:
beblebox wrote:
A very different wild approach could be to let them buy things from the west as is what they asks for. I mean what is the worst that can happen? That the people get food? They said we have nukes, if you do not let us buy things from the west we will start a war. UN answers with more sanctions. UN more or less declared war on horrible state that has nukes.
What is sanctioned these days ?
Weapons and related stuff + some luxyry everyday items.
All the more serious sanctions are vetoed by china and russia.
The issue is their will, they rather spend on military and shit rather than on their people.
There has to be a limit and in the case of NK, the limit has been reached.
But the response to the limit is what? I doubt the US + Allies canīt just invade NK like they did with Kuwait/Iraq back in the day. The nuclear threat is still there.
What is funny (or rather sad) about NK leadership is that they rather let their people starve to death than allow outside aid.
Aid is never free.
#1523920 by mrunne (Power User) at 2013-03-08 17:48:01 (4 months ago) - [Report]
mossi wrote:
mrunne wrote:
sniperfin wrote:
beblebox wrote:
A very different wild approach could be to let them buy things from the west as is what they asks for. I mean what is the worst that can happen? That the people get food? They said we have nukes, if you do not let us buy things from the west we will start a war. UN answers with more sanctions. UN more or less declared war on horrible state that has nukes.
What is sanctioned these days ?
Weapons and related stuff + some luxyry everyday items.
All the more serious sanctions are vetoed by china and russia.
The issue is their will, they rather spend on military and shit rather than on their people.
There has to be a limit and in the case of NK, the limit has been reached.
But the response to the limit is what? I doubt the US + Allies canīt just invade NK like they did with Kuwait/Iraq back in the day. The nuclear threat is still there.
What is funny (or rather sad) about NK leadership is that they rather let their people starve to death than allow outside aid.
Aid is never free.
Red cross help costs something? Last I checked Africa has not given anything for everything they have gotten in aid.
Nah, you have such a advantage on weapons technology these days that it's totally different than 50-60 years ago.
I hope to god you're right, but i think the last 10 years have proven that without boots on the ground an insurgency is impossible to put down. Superior firepower only works against a standing uniformed enemy, unless the attacker has complete disregard for collateral damage. My unit, a logistics and transport battalion, operated under the assumption that we needed 10x the men and equipment to oppose a gorilla force.
Nah, you have such a advantage on weapons technology these days that it's totally different than 50-60 years ago.
I hope to god you're right, but i think the last 10 years have proven that without boots on the ground an insurgency is impossible to put down. Superior firepower only works against a standing uniformed enemy, unless the attacker has complete disregard for collateral damage. My unit, a logistics and transport battalion, operated under the assumption that we needed 10x the men and equipment to oppose a gorilla force.
But you don't really need to run the war by yourselves when it comes to Korea. South Koreas Army is really strong so this really can't be compared to Afghanistan or Iraq. What they do need to use is your superior firepower as Seoul lies so close to the border and will be in real danger if the north makes their move.
A very different wild approach could be to let them buy things from the west as is what they asks for. I mean what is the worst that can happen? That the people get food? They said we have nukes, if you do not let us buy things from the west we will start a war. UN answers with more sanctions. UN more or less declared war on horrible state that has nukes.
What is sanctioned these days ?
Weapons and related stuff + some luxyry everyday items.
All the more serious sanctions are vetoed by china and russia.
The issue is their will, they rather spend on military and shit rather than on their people.
There has to be a limit and in the case of NK, the limit has been reached.
But the response to the limit is what? I doubt the US + Allies canīt just invade NK like they did with Kuwait/Iraq back in the day. The nuclear threat is still there.
What is funny (or rather sad) about NK leadership is that they rather let their people starve to death than allow outside aid.
Its not going to be an invasion it would be a bloody mess if nk every fires anything at south korea.. sk and US will use their airforce to fire back, NK will retaliate with their small nukes.. US will retaliate with nukes and its over.
I am not so worried about this regime right now.. but just imagine this crazy regime in 30 years from now when they have hundreds of nukes and maybe nuclear submarines.. then shit wil get more scary.
Rodman is a Jane Fonda-esque useful idiot, the US should revoke his citizenship. Let him live there if he likes it so much, see if he can pull a multi- million salary in Pyongyang.
People don't realize how quickly a scenario like this can go south. It nearly happened before in Cuba, where they were prepared to fend off a US invasion with tactical nukes. Had that happened the US would have responded, and the ensuing chain reaction could have easily led to global nuclear war.
If John and Bobby Kennedy not have been the calm, level headed leaders they were , none of us would be here now.
#1524112 by unknown[81460] at 2013-03-09 22:58:01 (4 months ago) - [Report]
Head bangers all over the world have nukes, what difference does it make if NK have some too ?
#1524118 by orince (Power User) at 2013-03-10 00:12:01 (4 months ago) - [Report]
theres no difference cuz it wont happen anything. north korea can prolly wipe out usa in 15mins if they wanted to.
So apparently the south wants it own nukes now. It is like a tiny cold war with tiny nations, tiny bombs and tiny people. (sorry for racial stereotype ).
So apparently the south wants it own nukes now. It is like a tiny cold war with tiny nations, tiny bombs and tiny people. (sorry for racial stereotype ).
Im quite surprised it took this long and Id expect the rest of Asian power players (japan, Taiwan, Indonesia) to quickly follow suit since they already have the technical and resource capabilities to build one in a matter of months. This could have all been avoided if China had been more assertive with it's puppet state to the south who would have disappear long ago if it were not for China's continued support.
#1524318 by Timex (Power User) at 2013-03-12 01:07:56 (4 months ago) - [Report]
Yeah some one need to do something about this fascist state anyway. Who knows what they will do. They are desperate for cash and there is many people with a lot of cash that wants to go nuclear.
We can not let them be broke and not eliminate them. Its like preventing corruption. You need to give a politician high enough salary to be able to live on it but not high enough that all his friends will be bankers. If Kim is scraping for cash there is a severe risk that he will sell the bombs to desperate groups in society.
It is time to either shit or get of the pot. This National-socialist fascist monarchy needs to be dealt with, one way or another. Chances that he ever will reach the higher society is not even on the map.
North Korea going nuclear is a joke. At best, they can make a suitcase nuclear "bomblet"... the underground tests only prove they can make a nuclear bomb.
They didn't prove they can control with a good enough success rate missiles, they have lots of failures and they don't have high range missiles. They won't risk sending nuclear missiles with so much failure rate, it would be suicide.
I think they're just using the threat as leverage, probably out of desperation. They want more international aid in return of agreeing (again) to discontinue research and development of nuclear weapons.
Even with cutting the phone line and ending the cease fire, the north koreans have a lot of desertions - even the army is famished, cold, demoralized. I doubt an actual war will have success now.
China is not on their side this time, China agreed to sanctions unlike several times before when it was North Korea's ally. The NK know they won't be able to rely on them.
In my opinion, even though it's cruel, I would stop all international aid. No food, nothing.
A large percent of these food aids doesn't even reach the North Koreans - they're kept to feed the army and politicians.
Anyone complaining goes to gulags where they have tens if not hundreds of thousands of north koreans doing hard labor or basically working on making things for China and countries near the North Korea borders.
I would also block all monetary transactions (China at the moment doesn't agree to this, and they have huge amounts of north korean money in their banks)
Within months to a year of serious isolation, the army would no longer get even the smaller and smaller food rations they have now and may revolt.
If North Korea attacks South Korea, even though they have a big army, they wouldn't win against the current South Korea and US forces around the area. China would also not fight on their side this time.
The problem is even without nuclear weapons, Seoul and other cities will be bombed to hell (with classical ammunition) by North Koreans from locations in North Korea mountains that will be hard to destroy... so you'll have billions of dollars to invest in repairing the cities.
Then China would just come like US came in Europe at the end of the war and clean everything that's still of value, they're make the money held by NK in China banks disappear, you'll be left with a bankrupt country, with poor agriculture and some fishing and a lot of hungry mouths.
Then what do you do with the north koreans after let's say you win the war? You'll have millions of hungry north koreans, which you can compare to Jews in nazi concentration camps... they're not far away from that.
If South Korea needs to take care of them, they'll basically spend 20-50 years at a standstill spending all their money integrating the north koreans, giving them aid, recovering from the war, rebuilding bombed cities...
Nobody really wants a war.
#1524913 by tidus (Power User) at 2013-03-16 12:10:24 (4 months ago) - [Report]
Angelitta wrote:
Nobody really wants a war.
agree, but anyway this summer american "democracy" will come to north Korea. (war)
I don't find punishments useful to make NK stop nuclear tests.
The trouble with NK is that they are very frustrated for many reasons. And because of their isolation they suffer from anxiety.
They might be more responsive to repercussions if they would be dependent on some external supplies.
For example, China (China being their main ally) could supply NK with technology or materials. Once this supply chain has corrupted their system, pressures may be effective.
They might be more responsive to repercussions if they would be dependent on some external supplies.
For example, China (China being their main ally) could supply NK with technology or materials. Once this supply chain has corrupted their system, pressures may be effective.
NK is already almost completely reliant on external supplies from energy to food. The problem is their main supplier is China who provides them all their coal, oil, and basically every other basic supply needed to function so the UN sanctions never work since China doesn't ever go along with them.
World Politics at its finest. If you think about all the parties involved and the tactics they are using it is very interesting. The most notable is the struggle for power between the US and China. China uses North Korea to keep the Americans on there toes and the Americans use North Korea to gain trust and Authority with the UN. China I think was recently thrown off guard by the North Koreans actions of late and had to concede a small loss in the UN. Though you have to ask yourself, is it a loss when goods are passing between China and North Korea so easily? Does North Korea pose a security threat? Yes in an indirect way but it is a very minor one. With relations between China and the US growing on an economic level that threat will decrease even further. Iran the Middle East pose much more of a problem.
#1525993 by mrunne (Power User) at 2013-03-26 09:00:38 (4 months ago) - [Report]
NK does just not know when to leave be...
Quote:
Reuters) - North Korea said on Tuesday its strategic rocket and long-range artillery units have been ordered to be combat ready, targeting U.S. military bases on Guam, Hawaii and mainland America after U.S. bombers flew sorties threatening the North.
The order, issued in a statement from the North's military "supreme command", marks the latest fiery rhetoric from Pyongyang since the start of joint military drills by U.S. and South Korean forces early this month.
South Korea's defense ministry said it saw no sign of imminent military action by North Korea.
"From this moment, the Supreme Command of the Korean People's Army will be putting into combat duty posture No. 1 all field artillery units, including long-range artillery units and strategic rocket units, that will target all enemy objects in U.S. invasionary bases on its mainland, Hawaii and Guam," the North's KCNA news agency said.
The North previously threatened nuclear attack on the United States and South Korea, although it is not believed to have the capability to hit the continental United States with an atomic weapon. But the U.S. military's bases in the Pacific area are in range of its medium-range missiles.
South Korea's defense ministry said it had detected no signs of unusual activity by the North's military but will monitor the situation. The South and the U.S. military are conducting drills until the end of April, which they have stressed are strictly defensive in nature.
The North has previously threatened to strike back at the U.S. military accusing Washington of war preparations by using B-52 bombers which have flown over the Korean peninsula as part of the drills.
North Korea has said it has abrogated an armistice that ended the 1950-53 Korean War and threatened a nuclear attack on the United States.
(Power User) at 2013-03-08 16:45:35 (4 months ago) - [
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