Serious Chat > Multiculturalism has failed in Europe

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#1524928 by sniperfin (Camo admin) at 2013-03-16 15:15:25 (4 months ago) - [Report]

mbodnar wrote:

Funny seeing SF referred to as part of a right wing propaganda machine.

Yeah.
If your account is few hours old and your first post on SERIOUS chat is so obvious trollin/only seeking for a fight, then it's better that you stay away from this site.

#1524941 by mbodnar (Airborne Mod) at 2013-03-16 16:21:52 (4 months ago) - [Report]

I think that guy, and arabnuts that got disabled, is our old pal arabish.

#1524986 by sniperfin (Camo admin) at 2013-03-17 03:18:35 (4 months ago) - [Report]

mbodnar wrote:

I think that guy, and arabnuts that got disabled, is our old pal arabish.

Spot on, not bad for a right wing nutter like you !

And a person who has expressed his want to fuck my relatives in the ass is going to be disabled at same speed in the future too.

Last edited by sniperfin at 2013-03-17 03:34:15

#1525053 by unknown[532240] at 2013-03-17 16:38:46 (4 months ago) - [Report]

mrunne wrote:

And on what do you base your beliefs? You can't just say something without proof.

That's because I butt raped a few danes myself, I ain't really enjoy it.. not that much.. shit felt good than a motherfucker though. I ain't let them guys kiss me or nothing, but I did tear that motherfucking ass up I aint gonna lie about that. But that's what the mans oppressive system did to me.

#1525072 by mbodnar (Airborne Mod) at 2013-03-17 20:37:25 (4 months ago) - [Report]

Royal Navy gal ordered to remove uniform by Virgin Atlantic because it's offensive. To whom? Al-Queda?
Political correctness gone crazy.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article … ngers.html

#1525224 by qbert95 (Power User) at 2013-03-19 20:46:46 (4 months ago) - [Report]

Not to be outdone, in the epicenter of the one sided race debate that is the US where whites have no say there is a columnist in Philadelphia that is under heavy fire for daring to post an article about being racism whites face from blacks. Apparently it's racist to call blacks racist now...

Philadelphia Magazine editor faces critics on race article

#1525228 by TheBlues (Power User) at 2013-03-19 21:39:01 (4 months ago) - [Report]

Sad to see that this discussion about multiculturalism in Europe has turned into a debate on racism in the US. Where are the mods when you need them?

Oh right, they're giving out triangles to people with differing opinions to them.

#1525229 by qbert95 (Power User) at 2013-03-19 21:49:05 (4 months ago) - [Report]

It was merely to demonstrate that the cultural difference never go away so what you are experiencing in Europe is there to stay and there will be an institutional one sided approach to the issue where the non white Europeans will be the only ones "allowed" to talk about those issues openly. Eventually you may even have one of these in every city like we have here to enforce one sided "multiculturalism" through public intimidation on an official level....

(from article)

Quote:

Mayor Nutter last week requested that the Philadelphia Human Relations Commission consider whether the magazine and Huber deserved to be rebuked for the article.

#1525352 by unknown[81460] at 2013-03-20 21:09:25 (4 months ago) - [Report]

TheBlues wrote:

I pondered your post and also pondered whether it was actualy worth posting here. You are correct though.

It seems multicultureism has failed on these boards let alone feckin europe.

Same fukin shite over and over again from the same candidates, then goad others into being warned or banned. Disagree and either shut up or face being bullied into submission.

Its soap box idiots like on here that really get on my tits. Its not the muslims or whoevers thats the issue. Its the inbred nazi loving fools. Then the bloody americans pipe up. Whatever you have they have twice as big.

Change the fukin record. Same folk spoutin the same shite killing this site.

#1525387 by mrunne (Power User) at 2013-03-21 08:06:53 (4 months ago) - [Report]

BoB wrote:

TheBlues wrote:

I've had plenty of differing opinions on this site without problems. The difference is I've expressed them civilized and without calling people names.

And whats this about being a inbred nazi loving fool? I hope you did not mean me, I dont advocate genocide or concentration camps. All I want is for the immigrant to assimilate to the host population, that is all.

Or is this about how they should be able to bring their shit with them and shove it down everyone elses throats without anyone complaining?

#1525389 by unknown[81460] at 2013-03-21 09:11:01 (4 months ago) - [Report]

Read a few posts anove about butt fuckin danes. That chap is quite obviously inbred and some kinda mad nazi or summit.

#1525399 by mrunne (Power User) at 2013-03-21 10:32:46 (4 months ago) - [Report]

BoB wrote:

Read a few posts anove about butt fuckin danes. That chap is quite obviously inbred and some kinda mad nazi or summit.

He was a troll and a bad one. The things he wrote were not for serious discussion

#1525400 by TheBlues (Power User) at 2013-03-21 10:48:39 (4 months ago) - [Report]

Islamophobia increases in Europe

Quote:

Islamophobia and discrimination against Muslims is widespread in Europe, especially after the financial crisis that fueled the nationalist and xenophobic tendencies. Increasingly, Muslim women are the target of hatred, said European...

Prejudice against Muslims, and anti-Muslim actions, are often more visible than those of other minorities, said Slot. Anti-Muslim actions could be violence against Muslims, vandalism at Islamic buildings or open protests against mosque building.

Even in countries like Poland, where several Muslim groups have lived integrated in the country for centuries, is now increasing the number of anti-Muslim attacks...

In Bulgaria, Muslims have repeatedly been attacked by members of the nationalistic Ataka party(TheBlues: Those are the Sverige Demokrater of Bulgaria). These were also there and threw eggs and stones at a mosque in Sofia, where several people were injured.

Especially Muslim women and girls are reportedly victims of growing Islamophobia: In France, it was 85 percent of all recorded attacks against Muslims, physical or verbal, against girls and women.

A third of Roma children in the Czech Republic has to auto classified as mentally retarded and placed in special schools. In Ireland sent job applications and CVs, all with equal qualifications, to a range of employers; half signed with recognizable Irish name and half with African, Asian or German names. The result was that twice the number of Irish applicants received offers to come to an interview.

http://translate.google.com/translate?s … mp;act=url

Notice how the right wing organizations that are springing up in Europe are deeply tied with Christianity. It should be no surprise that the most adamant defender of those organizations is deeply religious, namely hOG. He has several times alluded to a holy war between Islam and Christianity, whilst secular nationalists like sniperfin worry more about the biological side of race mixing. Which he hinted at waaay back in this thread (or was it another thread?) in which he proposed that humans from Africa and the Middle East were genetically predisposed to lesser intellectual abilities.

What's really interesting though is whether this post is will earn me another red triangle. Only time will tell, I suppose.

#1525409 by sniperfin (Camo admin) at 2013-03-21 11:45:04 (4 months ago) - [Report]

Quote:

, whilst secular nationalists like sniperfin worry more about the biological side of race mixing.

WHAT ?

Quote:

Which he hinted at waaay back in this thread (or was it another thread?) in which he proposed that humans from Africa and the Middle East were genetically predisposed to lesser intellectual abilities.

It was a genuine question due the fact that it is a FACT that genes play a vital role in human beings and for example all others than africans have neanderthal genes.
Where in my posts I have said that difference in intellectuality gives a right to discrimination ?
Or that people of different biological backgrounds should not mix ?
And if you remember, your own posts about studies concerning nature vs nurture were noted.
Currently Im in the position, "I don't know", the subject is not studied well enough, which was also my position when I first asked a question.
But in current world it's either racist or islamofobic to rise a genuine question based on observations when the question is not politically correct.
Nobody questions a a question based on how well black men and women perform in running, the question of genes have been risen many times.
To draw a conclusion like you do is just plain idiotic.
As I have said thousands times over, every human being should be equal and have similar rights, that includes the ability to be together with who ever they want to.

Im sorry, but your posts are now pretty laughable.

Quote:

What's really interesting though is whether this post is will earn me another red triangle. Only time will tell, I suppose.

My mama was a martyr, my papa was a martyr, and I am a martyr.
:violin:

#1525413 by hOG (Crusader Mod) at 2013-03-21 12:30:56 (4 months ago) - [Report]

@TheBlues

I have no idea what islamophobia is. Whether it is criticism of Islam as it is usually percieved or actual physical assaulting. Why won't you let yourself be confronted with the other side of the coin? You don't ask the question 'why Muslims and not sikhs? Why the mosque and not the temple? etc. considering your argument anything not Christian would do.
I don't see this as being tied to Christianity. I see the various defense leagues, loose organizations as they are, making logical associations to history (crusades eg.). That doesn't connect them to the religion of Christianity necessarily, just as naming your blog Gates of Vienna doesn't mean you tie yourself deeply in with the history of Vienna or the defense of that great city. Not that it matters much to someone, I suspect, who argues there is no difference between the world religions.

In any of the Nordic countries you know as well as I do that this conflict is not about religion. Maybe further down south, but not up here where we happen to live. If you ask me then what is it about I would reply using this article, this is what is wrong, Mr.Blues:

By Karl-Olov Arnstberg and Gunnar Sandelin

Quote:

Foreword:

This article, "Sweden cannot handle that much immigration," was rejected by DN Debate, opinion page of the Swedish newspaper Dagens Nyheter. We have also written a shortened version that was refused admission to the leading Swedish newspapers, Gothenburg-Posten, Sydsvenska Dagbladet and Svenska Dagbladet.

To give these newspapers an opportunity for open discussion, so they can no longer reject certain views which only exist on the internet, we wrote to Dagens Nyheter that it is imperative that the major Swedish media regain control of these topics so crucial for Sweden's future:

"We hereby grant DN the opportunity to open up our article for discussion. We understand and anticipate that our book will stimulate debate in the blogosphere, but it is imperative for Swedish politics and opinion that the heavy media is leading the way."

Sadly, one possibility none of the media would take.

----

Sweden cannot handle that much immigration

Professor of ethnology and social worker and journalist: Swedish politicians have lost control over immigration. The costs escalating housing situation is desperate, unemployment rises and segregation is almost dramatic

In 2012 Funded Migration (Immigration) combined approx. 111,000 residence permits. The number of asylum seekers increased by 48 percent compared to 2011. If we compare with our Nordic neighbors with Sweden last year, that is eight times more permanent residence than Finland, five times more than Denmark and more than twice as many as Norway.

After Germany and France, Sweden is the country in Europe that takes up most asylum seekers.

During the Iraq war took Sweden to almost half of all Iraqis who fled to Europe. We have accepted most Somalis in the Western world, and we are now the largest recipient in Europe of Syrian refugees. With regard to refugees per. capita, Sweden has for many years been at the top of the Western world.

For 2013, the forecast for family reunification can be downgraded somewhat since the number of Somali family reunification is not expected to be as large as previously. But the figures are uncertain, and they are expected to increase if the civil war in Syria either escalates or spreads.

Migrationsverket's forecast for this year is at least 100,000 new asylum seekers and family reunifications.

Many illiterate

Immigration has changed over time. A wide spectrum of immigrants are replaced by mainly asylum seekers from Muslim countries such as Syria, Somalia and Afghanistan. These are ill-equipped for life in the decidedly high-tech Sweden.

Employment Service statistics show that over 60 percent of the new arrivals and their families at most have what is called "pre-secondary education."

This means that many are actual or practical illiterate, making it more difficult for them to find work in a labor market where only 2.5 percent of the jobs according to Eurostat are within their ability.

This differs from the rest of the EU, where the supply of labor to those who completely lack education, is on average 17 percent. Sweden, in other words, is extremely low on jobs to offer asylum applicants and their dependents who are allowed to stay in Sweden.

This means that the already large gap in participation rates of 27 percent between domestic-and foreign-born aged 25-64 years increased. (SBC 2012). As the respected British magazine Economist noted in February this year, a large proportion of the non-European immigrants granted residence in Sweden, to be the permanent state dependents of taxpayers' money.

21 percent are refugees

The media describes all asylum seekers as 'refugees'. This is not true, since the refugee concept is linked to the Geneva Convention and the Aliens Act. Of the asylum seekers who have been staying in Fredrik Reinfeldt's time as prime minister to and including this year, 21 percent were refugees.

If we choose a longer period, taking 1980 as a starting point, the corresponding number is much smaller, 10 percent. Almost half got to stay on humanitarian grounds, while about a quarter were granted asylum as 'being in need of protection'. (Migrationsverket statistics are incomplete so far as the 1980s the first part.)

During recent years there has been a migration through family unification programs approximately three times as large as asylum migration. The majority of the applicants consists of newly established family relationships. It is therefore not a family reunion, but most of the partners taken here from the former homelands.

Here one should note that Sweden, after what we've been able to find out, is the only country that allows people on public assistance can take relatives to do so. Relatives who also most likely be supported by the public.

The general rule in the rest of Europe is that which brings the family or partner, also will be responsible for providing for them for. Unlike in Sweden. According migration minister Tobias Billstr�m it is less than one percent of the families of asylum seekers who have been allowed to stay that are able to support themselves.

Sweden is also the country that takes up most asylum children. In 2012, 3,600 applied for a residence. More than two third of this category were granted permanent residence. No other country is close to these numbers. Mainly, these asylum seekers from Somalia and Afghanistan.

"Young asylum seekers" is a more accurate term, since one before the asylum test is done, do not know whether they come alone, can claim refugee status or are minors. That the last bit is far from always the case X-rays of hands and teeth in neighboring countries have shown.

rest of article here: http://denkorteavis.dk/2013/censuren-i- … de-former/

:violin:

#1525421 by unknown[81460] at 2013-03-21 13:22:29 (4 months ago) - [Report]

The percentage of applicants for highly skilled jobs here is surprisingly high. Cant quote stats as thats a confidentiality breech.

#1525424 by sniperfin (Camo admin) at 2013-03-21 13:39:36 (4 months ago) - [Report]

BoB wrote:

The percentage of applicants for highly skilled jobs here is surprisingly high. Cant quote stats as thats a confidentiality breech.

Not supricing. Nordic countries due our wellfare system attracts different people than many other countries. For example somalis have been here almost 25 years now and their unemployment percentage is over 50. Similar figures among middle-eastern people.
On the contrary, asian people are well employed and skilled.
Those who came in the late 90's from balkan areas are also well employed (many of them have their own businesses).
The main problem in nordic countries is that we have way too much people coming in who only burden the wellfare system. The amount of people who integrate and become active members of the society is way too low when you look at the total amount of people coming in.

#1525426 by Arnemes (Power User) at 2013-03-21 13:42:39 (4 months ago) - [Report]

BoB wrote:

The percentage of applicants for highly skilled jobs here is surprisingly high. Cant quote stats as thats a confidentiality breech.

Not to many here(in Sweden). You earn much more cash in the UK for the same job and don't have to learn a new language as most highly educated already speak English.

#1525477 by unknown[81460] at 2013-03-21 20:05:00 (4 months ago) - [Report]

Arnemes wrote:

BoB wrote:

The percentage of applicants for highly skilled jobs here is surprisingly high. Cant quote stats as thats a confidentiality breech.

Not to many here(in Sweden). You earn much more cash in the UK for the same job and don't have to learn a new language as most highly educated already speak English.

Luckily in the UK we operate new labour market testing, which basically means unless there is a viable candidate for a job from the UK or the EU and the job has met new labour market testing (advertised for more than a month across at least 3 major mediums) and evidence can be found that its a shortage of occupation then you don't get a work permit. Just a brief overview.

edit: as sniper said / highlighted on most tend to be self employed, and to add to that they then "look out for their own".

#1525661 by TheBlues (Power User) at 2013-03-23 16:18:03 (4 months ago) - [Report]

sniperfin wrote:

And if you remember, your own posts about studies concerning nature vs nurture were noted.
Currently Im in the position, "I don't know", the subject is not studied well enough, which was also my position when I first asked a question.
But in current world it's either racist or islamofobic to rise a genuine question based on observations when the question is not politically correct.
...
Im sorry, but your posts are now pretty laughable.

I had to bait you a little bit because you've stopped replying to my posts on immigration even though I've been pretty harsh against you. I know why though, it's because you're having difficulties supporting your emotional response towards immigration with logical arguments.

Speaking of your 'genuine question based on observations', surely you know that making any sort of assumptions based on observations that fall in line with stereotypes is the biggest pitfall in terms of scientific inquiries. You ask the question not because it's supported by evidence but because it would complement your worldview. It's just like how a lot of spiritual people propose that there might be an afterlife without any supporting facts, it's simply fits well with their erroneous view of the world.

Quote:

Travelers were divided by skin color!

Passengers who were on their way to Ecker�linjen Aland Ferry placed by a driver in two separate buses - one for "Swedes" and one for "people of foreign appearance,"

The travelers who earlier this week was at the City Terminal in Stockholm to take the bus to Grisslehamn and �landsf�rjan separated by the color. Passengers with foreign appearance was riding in a bus, and passengers with Swedish appearance rode another bus, says DN.

- We felt humiliated, insulted and discriminated against.

http://translate.google.com/translate?s … mp;act=url

Quote:

Ambulance service in G�vleborg has today launched an investigation after it emerged that paramedics refused to run a 16 year old who jumped from a window to a hospital. The boy was rather go with the police to the emergency room.

An anonymous source tells Arbetarbladet that someone in the ambulance staff said it was just as well to let the 16-year-old jump: "It's just a refugee."

- Regardless of ethnic origin, regardless of age and gender, we should not make a difference, and makes no difference, the people who go with our shipments, says J�rgen Tranevik.

He points out that the county's citizens must have confidence in the ambulance service.

- We shall stand for security and care and excellence. We have 43000 file in our county for years, but this takes the sting out of the issue of trust. Of course it is extremely worrying.

http://translate.google.com/translate?h … 021694.svd

hOG, your vision of Sweden is coming true!

:whatever:

#1525665 by hOG (Crusader Mod) at 2013-03-23 16:40:56 (4 months ago) - [Report]

@theblues

I realize you have to bait me with nonsensical arguments and emoticons, because I've persisted against your immoral and illogical jihad using sound argumentation and you've come to realize that you're having difficulties supporting mass immigration with logical arguments.

#1525667 by Arnemes (Power User) at 2013-03-23 16:53:07 (4 months ago) - [Report]

@theblues

The boy who jumped hit an air pumped mat which the fire departement had placed below the window and didn't have a scratch on him. The racial comments where unnecessary and stupid thought, but i honestly think that the same people would make insulting comments against a white person for being stupid etc. too as they where standing below for hours waiting.

The divided passengers where not divided into buses with white and immigrants(at least according to the bus driver) but with people going to buy cheap snus/tobacco in one bus and others in the other one. This because the ones who wanted tobacco where behaving themselves bad.

#1525668 by sniperfin (Camo admin) at 2013-03-23 17:04:55 (4 months ago) - [Report]

Quote:

Quote:

Speaking of your 'genuine question based on observations', surely you know that making any sort of assumptions based on observations that fall in line with stereotypes is the biggest pitfall in terms of scientific inquiries.

I didn't make any assumption. We have an observation, I rised a question asking if this could explain the observation.

Quote:

You ask the question not because it's supported by evidence but because it would complement your worldview.

If I would have enough evidence, I would not ask questions, I would represent it as an answer.
I asked the question because I am curious person who likes to know things and I am not afraid to accept answers which are not politically correct.
What comes to genes, it's well known that they play a key role on us humans, so my question is as valid as it can get and has a solid scientific foundation behind it. If genes have made us different in many physical ways, could it be that they also have affect on our brains and how intellectual we are.

You have lost the debate (we have all the facts and arguments behind us), therefore you have to rely on "bating" (I don't believe that you were bating, you were encouraged by bob's post and you wrote in anger, now you regret your stupid post and try to excuse it, cause it makes you look like an idiot).
But I feel for you, you come from immigration backgound and you have muslim relatives, ofcourse you have to try speak for both groups, since your encounters with both groups (like hOG earlier said, you come from a priviledged muslim background) is something else what the reality is.
You are blindfolded by bias and you refuse to see the world outside your comfort bubble.

#1525669 by TheBlues (Power User) at 2013-03-23 17:06:06 (4 months ago) - [Report]

hOG wrote:

Actually, I feel guilty for not replying to a few of your posts. I think I have written at least three drafts for replies that I haven't had time to finish. My life has been a bit chaotic lately so I've had less time to fuck around online (and I'm actually leaving for another country in 3 hours and I'll be gone for a whole month). But rest assured, a reply is coming as soon I have the time to produce a wall of text.

Arnemes wrote:

The divided passengers where not divided into buses with white and immigrants(at least according to the bus driver) but with people going to buy cheap snus/tobacco in one bus and others in the other one. This because the ones who wanted tobacco where behaving themselves bad.

You're correct about the kid who jumped out of a window. But the dividing of the passengers was not okay. The point was that he assumed that every foreign looking person was troublemaking snus-buyer and every non-swede was not.

#1525671 by Arnemes (Power User) at 2013-03-23 17:08:43 (4 months ago) - [Report]

TheBlues wrote:

But the dividing of the passengers was not okay. The point was that he assumed that every foreign looking person was troublemaking snus-buyer and every non-swede was not.

Thought it was the opposite? sorry, must've misread. In that case, you are correct.

Last edited by Arnemes at 2013-03-23 17:08:57

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