Serious Chat > Multiculturalism has failed in Europe

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#1376351 by dodeliatcha (User) at 2011-02-09 15:04:21 (2 years ago) - [Report]

mbodnar wrote:

dodeliatcha wrote:

how are the deportation laws in the United States? considering you are an immigrant nation, how do people view immigration in your countries? and crime etc..can legal immigrants aswell as illegal immigrants get deported? I mean when they do crimes..

President Obama has been deporting more illegals than his predecessors, but it's a drop in the bucket. We find someone is illegal, set up an immigration hearing, and the illegal doesn't show up. We do not have nearly the resources to go find them so they remain in the states. The only way to solve the problem is to secure the border, once they're in there's little we can do about it. Well trained sniper/spotter teams seems to be a logical and cost effective solution.

What if you are a legal immigrant..say on green card, working for some science company or something and do something illegal?? Its still deportation right? or does it depend on the crime..

#1376358 by VeryBadGuy Donor

(Mad Ultra Mod) at 2011-02-09 15:19:45 (2 years ago) - [Report]

dodeliatcha wrote:

What if you are a legal immigrant..say on green card, working for some science company or something and do something illegal?? Its still deportation right? or does it depend on the crime..

There are Criminal grounds, Immigration grounds, Imigration Status Violation grounds and Security grounds for deportation.

http://www.criminalandimmigrationlaw.co … cklist.pdf

Find it all there.

#1376533 by unknown[76452] at 2011-02-09 23:40:45 (2 years ago) - [Report]

I was just thinking about something, if we take muslims or even non-muslims from other countries, why are they in 99% of the cases the ones doing criminal acts? And why are these people the ones that abuse the system, dont follow laws or regulations or anything?

But If we take Asian people, no problem, they behave, they adapt and they work and follow laws and everthing EVEN tho they are also in the SAME situation as other foreign people.

Anyone else been thinking about this?

#1376535 by qbert95 (Power User) at 2011-02-09 23:53:32 (2 years ago) - [Report]

I dont believe that is true at all. Take the US for example where there is zero association with Muslims and crime or being criminals. They actually have a very positive image of being very intelligent and extremely entrepreneurial (which is a very positive trait in the US). I think it has more to do with where those Muslims in Europe are coming from being more of a reason for their lack of civility than being muslim has.

#1376544 by unknown[76452] at 2011-02-10 00:57:45 (2 years ago) - [Report]

qbert95 wrote:

Can you give me some reliable statistics on that?

#1376545 by qbert95 (Power User) at 2011-02-10 01:02:44 (2 years ago) - [Report]

tomati wrote:

Can you give me some reliable statistics on that?

Muslims in America � A Statistical Portrait

Quote:

Contrary to popular perceptions, the condition of Muslims in the U.S. is very good. Among South Asians in this country, the large Indian American community stands out as particularly well educated and prosperous, with education and income levels that exceed those of U.S.-born whites. Many are professionals, especially doctors, scientists, engineers, and financial analysts, and there are also a large number of entrepreneurs. The five urban areas with the largest Indian populations include the Washington/Baltimore metropolitan area as well as New York, Chicago, Los Angeles, and San Francisco. The 10 states with the largest Muslim populations are California, New York, Illinois, New Jersey, Indiana, Michigan, Virginia, Texas, Ohio, and Maryland. 45 percent of immigrant Muslims report annual household income levels of $50,000 or higher. This compares to the national average of 44 percent. Immigrant Muslims are well represented among higher-income earners, with 19 percent claiming annual household incomes of $100,000 or higher (compared to 16 percent for the Muslim population as a whole and 17 percent for the U.S. average). This is likely due to the strong concentration of Muslims in professional, managerial, and technical fields, especially in information technology, education, medicine, law, and the corporate world

#1376635 by sniperfin (Camo admin) at 2011-02-10 12:50:25 (2 years ago) - [Report]

http://translate.google.com/translate?j … 083934.htm

original:
http://www.dr.dk/Nyheder/Udland/2011/02/10/083934.htm

Norway shows film about gay people to asylum seekers. Homosexuality is accepted in norway and if you want to come and live here you have to accept that.

Quote:

In Norway, asylumseekers forced to watch a film about homosexuals.The aim is that tell about the broad framework, society has.
We will prove that homosexuality is normal and acceptabelt. If you want to live in Norway and be a part of the Norwegian society, one must acceptere it, says movie director Mari Finnestad.

@qbert
Yeah, USA has well integrated muslims due the fact that you don't give them any special treatment and the poeple who come there are ready to adapt and live the american life and build their future by themselves, not by getting money from the government.
As I mentioned earlier, the fact that you are behind the sea means that you also get those who are better educated and many already know your language (which is universal), in europe we have so many languages and many are tiny languages.
It's much easier to integrate when you know the language right from the getgo.

Last edited by sniperfin at 2011-02-10 12:51:05

#1376661 by VeryBadGuy Donor

(Mad Ultra Mod) at 2011-02-10 14:58:25 (2 years ago) - [Report]

sniperfin wrote:

As I mentioned earlier, the fact that you are behind the sea means that you also get those who are better educated and many already know your language (which is universal), in europe we have so many languages and many are tiny languages.
It's much easier to integrate when you know the language right from the getgo.

behind a sea when it comes to African, Asian and Middle Eastern immigrants.
But we still get loads and loads and loads of South American, Cuban and Hatian immigrants.
Many who cannot speak English, live in communities like Little Havana in Miami and we have actually gone far enough that while officially not endorsing Spanish as an official language..you surely won't work in parts of Florida, Arizona, Texas or California without being bilingual.

#1376664 by sniperfin (Camo admin) at 2011-02-10 15:16:18 (2 years ago) - [Report]

VeryBadGuy wrote:

sniperfin wrote:

True, I just was referring to muslims. South american immigrants are your muslims in a way.
They do appriciate your culture in general much more than muslims here in europe, but for example many big crime organizations these days are south american (mexican mafia, all the violent gangs from various south american countries, the whole prison system is controlled by mexican mafia largely etc.).
And comparing to these groups cosa nostra was a minor league gang.

#1376840 by sniperfin (Camo admin) at 2011-02-11 00:22:45 (2 years ago) - [Report]

http://www.france24.com/en/20110210-mul … -questions

Quote:

French President Nicolas Sarkozy declared multiculturalism a failed concept and called for a renewed focus on France's "identity" when he appeared on TV Thursday evening to answer questions from French citizens

British Prime Minister David Cameron last month pronounced his country's long-standing policy of multiculturalism a failure, calling for better integration of young Muslims to combat home-grown extremism.

German Chancellor Angela Merkel, Australia's former prime minister John Howard and former Spanish prime minister Jose Maria Aznar have also in recent months said multicultural policies have not successfully integrated immigrants.

Looks like that when somebody finally had to courage to say that the king has no clothes everybody can admit it.

#1377073 by MrShish Donor

(Power User) at 2011-02-11 22:47:56 (2 years ago) - [Report]

do you prefer monoculturalism?

Last edited by MrShish at 2011-02-11 22:48:06

#1377075 by hOG (Crusader Mod) at 2011-02-11 22:53:04 (2 years ago) - [Report]

Quote:

Multiculturalism has failed in Europe

Has the EU failed? :hmmm:

#1377076 by sniperfin (Camo admin) at 2011-02-11 23:00:17 (2 years ago) - [Report]

MrShish wrote:

do you prefer monoculturalism?

No, but multiculturalism where the principles of western justice society are the base and where multicultralism does not mean that the different cultures live in isolation inside the society,such way that it's the members of original culture who pays the bills is not real multiculturalism and that multiculturalism has failed, naturally.

#1377151 by Sargoth (Power User) at 2011-02-12 11:32:36 (2 years ago) - [Report]

sniperfin wrote:

http://www.france24.com/en/20110210-multiculturalism-failed-immigration-sarkozy-live-broadcast-tf1-france-public-questions

Quote:

Looks like that when somebody finally had to courage to say that the king has no clothes everybody can admit it.

Sarkozy ends multiculturalism, speaks on Islam
http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=-Azu7biTbWY

I thought he raised some important points.

#1377165 by hOG (Crusader Mod) at 2011-02-12 12:55:52 (2 years ago) - [Report]

What that french buffon Sarkozy is talking about is really the city and suburb ghettos native to France. Don't be misled by his political agenda. He is one of the worst presidents that country has had, only toppled by his predessesor who has gotten France into this mess to begin with - Chirac. I'm still laughing at the suggestion that Sarkozy made 2 years ago - banning burkas to solve the integration problem, nice.

And what an arrogant statement to make of France and England, two countries that even today exert great power over their former colonies, they are still to some extent colonial powers even today. They need to face up to that challenge in a real way, not run a way from it like headless chickens.

Last edited by hOG at 2011-02-12 13:02:56

#1377166 by Sargoth (Power User) at 2011-02-12 12:59:08 (2 years ago) - [Report]

I was thinking more of integrating into the nationality and not forming seperate communities, which are bound to clash sooner or later.

#1377455 by unknown[397565] at 2011-02-13 11:20:40 (2 years ago) - [Report]

sniperfin wrote:

MrShish wrote:

do you prefer monoculturalism?

It's the old "integration" problem, it's a problem decades old that's never been fixed. You don't fix that by just handing out money. They can keep their culture ofc but there must be a minimum of social interaction and national identity between the various groups or "cultures" in a society, otherwise there's too much conflict. A nation should have a set of values common between all its citizens. The fundamental values our nations are built upon are often opposed altogether by some groups of immigrants....as far as im concerned thats unacceptable. Common goals/values is what prompted the build of our nations in the first place, having immigrants migrating here with completely different ideas on the basic stuff (human rights!) is not much different than an invasion.

It has nothing to do with multiculturalism imho, it's the same old problem with immigrants being detached from the rest of society. Closing all doors and making things harder (those politician aim) will make other cultures even more detached from the rest. Specially the honest ones who actually follow the law usually get hit by this stuff, the rest doesnt give a fuck about whatever law we make for them. These politicians just wanna use the integration problems, which evidently have not been taken seriously enough in the previous years, and turn em in a "those people problem" for their own nationalistic and possibly even closet racist purposes. Obviously corrupting our values to make them feel more at home was retarded, and I wonder whose idea was in the first place and what was the real aim of that, cause thats seriously retarded.

edit:

oh and about that women only pool hours or just muslims woman hours or whatever...we left that man/woman division crap behind us some time ago, who was that retard who allowed/decided for this stuff?
WHOEVER decided in favour of that is the REAL problem. You shouldn't be angry with Muslims, but with that dumb ass.

#1377702 by Sargoth (Power User) at 2011-02-14 11:14:51 (2 years ago) - [Report]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article … eaten.html

# Undercover footage shows pupils being taught religious apartheid
# Muslims who adopt Western ways will be 'tortured in afterlife'
# Unprovoked beatings captured on camera in Yorkshire madrassa
# Boy threatened with bench by senior student left in charge of class

Quote:

...
This school is required by its inspectors to teach tolerance and respect for other faiths. But the Channel 4 current affairs programme Dispatches filmed secretly inside it � and instead discovered that Muslim children are being taught religious apartheid and social segregation.

We recorded a number of speakers giving deeply disturbing talks about Jews, Christians and atheists.

We found children as young as 11 learning that Hindus have �no intellect� and that they �drink cow p***�.

And we came across pupils being told that the �disbelievers� are �the worst creatures� and that Muslims who adopt supposedly non-Muslim ways, such as shaving, dancing, listening to music and � in the case of women � removing their headscarves, would be tortured with a forked iron rod in the afterlife.

In 2009 this school was praised by Government-approved inspection teams for its interfaith teachings. The report said that �pupils learn about the beliefs and practices of other faiths and are taught to show respect to other world religions�.

It seems that the inspectors were unaware of the teaching methods revealed by our undercover reporter, Osman. He was taken on as a volunteer at the Darul Uloom school in Birmingham in April 2009 and was allowed to sit in on some lessons � but not their Islamic classes.

...

The film shows children as young as six sitting on the floor of a large room in the mosque, one of the biggest in the country. The boys are hunched over wooden benches, rocking backwards and forwards as they rote-learn the Koran in Arabic. A man with a long white beard dressed in a traditional shalwar kameez � tunic and trousers � sits at the head of the class.

Periodically he gets up and walks behind the boys. As he passes, the children appear to cower and watch him nervously. It soon becomes clear why.

He unexpectedly raises his hand and slaps a young boy hard on the head. Moments later he strikes another. And then he kicks a third child.

In just two days of filming in December 2010, the camera recorded the teacher hitting children as young as six or seven at least ten times, in less than three hours of lessons.

From what we could see, every �single blow was pretty much unprovoked. We soon realised that the beatings were routine. The behaviour of the boys, the way they flinched and backed away when he approached, indicated that they were long-accustomed to being hit and kicked as they studied.

In another incident an older boy, left in charge of a class while a teacher is out at prayer, picks up a bench and threatens to hit a younger boy with it.
...

Hmm I wonder if this is a Saudi funded school?

"* Dispatches: Lessons In Hatred And Violence is on Channel 4 tomorrow at 8pm."
Anyone in the UK that can record it? I don't think I get Channel 4.

Part 2 is about integration, which could be interesting to see their views.
Video
pt 1. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v3hFT6gJ8NE
pt 2. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2jhYw1wu_n8
pt 3. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7hQpk1cqHo
pt 4. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQmZfm_hXuo
pt 5. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3L9e69MUdQA

Last edited by Sargoth at 2011-02-15 04:33:30

#1378273 by sniperfin (Camo admin) at 2011-02-15 22:57:22 (2 years ago) - [Report]

Dutch join the failure gang:

Quote:

Multiculturalism has failed: Verhagen
Tuesday 15 February 2011

Christian Democrat leader Maxime Verhagen on Monday said the multicultural society has failed. He was speaking during the recording of tv show Nova College Tour, reports the Algemeen Dagblad.

Verhagen told the programme the Dutch no longer feel at home in their own country and immigrants are not entirely happy here either.

The minister wants the Dutch to be prouder of their country like people in the US where they first say they are American and then where they originally come from, says the paper.

He follows his European colleagues in declaring multiculturalism a failure. German chancellor Angela Merkel, British prime minister David Cameron and French president Nicolas Sarkozy have all said the same, the paper states.

http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2 … led_ve.php

Country by country those who have significant muslim immigrant population are now opening their mouths. Hopefully the PC days are over and UN also addresses these issues. The declaration about how islam can't be critisized must be declared as failed immediatetly.

Last edited by sniperfin at 2011-02-15 22:57:50

#1378277 by qbert95 (Power User) at 2011-02-15 23:05:40 (2 years ago) - [Report]

sniperfin wrote:

Quote:

Multiculturalism has failed: Verhagen
The minister wants the Dutch to be prouder of their country like people in the US where they first say they are American and then where they originally come from, says the paper.

That's not true at all, at least not in the last 20 years. The liberal establishment has made sure its "community organizers" within each racial group preach that it would be selling out to the white man to dare call yourself American without first hyphenating it with what you are most proud of.

#1378377 by hOG (Crusader Mod) at 2011-02-16 11:34:05 (2 years ago) - [Report]

sniperfin wrote:

Dutch join the failure gang:

Quote:

"Multiculturalim" has failed, vote for us.

#1378383 by sniperfin (Camo admin) at 2011-02-16 11:54:10 (2 years ago) - [Report]

hOG wrote:

sniperfin wrote:

Dutch join the failure gang:

Quote:

"Multiculturalim" has failed, vote for us.

Sure, thats one way to look at it, but if that brings you votes it just shows that the voters agree --> democracy in a nutshell, trying to do decisions which follow the peoples position on matters.

#1378389 by hOG (Crusader Mod) at 2011-02-16 12:17:56 (2 years ago) - [Report]

Or it is an attempt at mob-control? Do you know what is *their* alternative to this "multiculturalism"? It seems so easy to say with 25 years of immigration (UN demands it) and fugitives (based on a country's national policy) - that multi-culturalism is "wrong", "dead", whatever.. but what we do now?! Did you know that the dutch Christian Democrats are some of the most conservative (I think the mayor in Dam is currently CDD). Not a surprise to hear this from them.

edit: sorry for not making much sense.. it be difficult to get what you want out with just one hand.

edit2:

mbodnar wrote:

hOG wrote:

edit: sorry for not making much sense.. it be difficult to get what you want out with just one hand.

Don't fap and type then.

Oh mbodnar you... thankfully my right hand is all right

I've dislocated my left shoulder from falling.

Last edited by hOG at 2011-02-16 16:50:03

#1378420 by mbodnar (Airborne Mod) at 2011-02-16 14:53:21 (2 years ago) - [Report]

hOG wrote:

edit: sorry for not making much sense.. it be difficult to get what you want out with just one hand.

Don't fap and type then.

#1378619 by Timex (Power User) at 2011-02-17 07:30:50 (2 years ago) - [Report]

Quote:

I've dislocated my left shoulder from falling.

Sorry to hear that and hope you recover 100%.
I used to be a physical superman untill my back injury in 2002.
Old age and Murphy's Law takes it's toll on us all.

Last edited by Timex at 2011-02-17 07:33:13

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